Contrastate interview from Audio Drudge Magazine #7 1996



By all accounts, Britain's Contrastate remains one of the most unique, captivating outfits in existence... so why does it seem like they're forever overlooked and unrecognized? This is a group like no other, whose mesmerizing electro-acoustic and electronic textures, haunting atmospheres, and thought provoking lyrics never fail to amaze. Discover them. The following was done via mail with member's Stephen Meixner and Jonathan Grieve.

AD: A brief overview of how Contrastate came into existence?

JG: Before we, (Stephen Meixner and Myself), set up Contrastate we did a couple of theater performances which Steve did the music for and I wrote the scipts (we both performed). Stephen suggested that we just concentrate on the music so we tried an improvised gig at our college, which though lasting only three of our allotted fifteen minutes at least proved we were talented enough to get thrown off stage. Then we started writing guitar based songs inspired by groups like Laibach Foetus, and Glenn Branca. After messing around with this for a while (it wasn't really working), we decided to go to Geneva and play some hard, painful industrial type noise (I had a friend there who said he could organize a gig for us). That was really what kicked Contrastate into action.

AD: Was there any sort of clear idea what you wanted to do at that point?

JG: I think that musically it was a bit of an adventure. I had previously only played in rock bands as a guitarist and singer so this kind of music was something very new to me. I think Stephen had a much clearer idea of what we wanted to do. Philosophically our ideas started to develop towards wanting to create music that was critical of itself and in a kind of state of permanent revolution, hence the name Contrastate, something which is able to remain in a state of flux whilst maintaining a recognizable identity. Musically our approach has been to be challenging without preaching, and to be provocative without necessarily resorting to an aural assault. Having said that our first ever full length gig was oriented towards full out noise, though even at that time we had a notion of the ambient type sound we developed afterwards. In answer to your question we didn't start out with no idea, but the process creating for Contrastate has developed over the years and has thus defined itself as we have gone along.

AD: Has your initial outlook and goals changed since that time?

JG: Yes, our initial outlook and goals have changed, that is because of the usual reasons, working within limitations and realizing what just is possible, trying things out and learning from our mistakes. I think Contrastate is still in its infancy, so in fact many of the goals that we originally held still haven't been fulfilled. Having said that I never really imagined that we would get even this far. The fundamental purpose behind Contrastate has remained the same, that of trying to remain constantly challenging to ourselves and not just to the audience. Taking on new influences, not just in the "scene". Trying different ways of making the music, not being purely acoustic, or electronic, using sampling and improvisation. We have deliberately not allied ourselves to a particular form of experimentalism as it would defeat the purpose and creed behind what I would call exploratory music making.

AD: Are remnants of your background in theater now incorporated to some degree into Contrastate?

JG: I am still active in theater and film with a performance group in Londen creating a mix of live art and theater, so in many ways the remnants of the background in theater are for me much in the foreground. The texts for live are written in a sense as performance material and so are different I think from the studio material in that I try to create a role for them. I would like to bring the performance out of the music more, though not at the expence of losing the concepion of Contrastate as a band, because it gives playing live that risky and more spontaneous edge. People say the music is very filmic and dramatic however we don't make a conscious effort to do it, it is someting that comes naturally to us and probably lies in the approach that we take.

AD: What would you say is the main motivating factor behind Contrastate? Any particular inspiration before the recording or writing of new material?

SM: The main motivating factor is to produce good music that we enjoy and that hopefully other people enjoy too. The inspiration behind each recording varies with each project. For example, the inspiration behind "A live coal under the ashes" were the changes in eastern and central Europe during 1989/1990, more specifically I was interested in the political and social changes occuring at the time. I was also interested in the events leading to the changes and the implications of the future.

JG: Lyrically our intentions seem to have become concerned with challenging any form of status quo that exists for its own sake, for example forms of religious or political dogma that stands in the way of change and openness. Even more personal texts reflect this like "Perhaps it comes out of the black sea" and "At the bottom of my dreams" which are concerned with arrival of personal stasis, of being locked inside your mind and bad habits, and stuck in the unrelenting repetition of humen action and fantasy which leads one only back to oneself and never away.

AD: Do you then consider "1000 Badgers" to be a more personal release than "Throwing"?

JG: I think perhaps I used the wrong word and should say that the texts are more subjective than later ones. "A Thousand Badgers..." is certainly a more subjective release and a less socially aware one, but I don't think it makes it a more or less personal effort as a similar amount of energy and care has gone in to them all. The first three releases "Seven Hands...", "A Thousand Badgers...", and "i" were all to a certain extend concerned with birth and coming into the world, self definitio and belief. It was only with "i" that we began focusing our attacks, albeit loosely, and in that case on organized religion. The reason it was called "i" was because the music seemed to suggest the orientation of the individiual within systems and the problem of finding an identity that isn't the product of social coercion. Since those releases we've found it easier to take the problems from different points of view, not just our own, creating insights into the minds of those systems that we believe cause the oppression.

AD: Tell me about "Throwing out the Baby with the Bathwater" particularly the significance of the titles and lyrics, which seem to speak of a nostalgia for the past as well as a sense of hopelessness and loss for the future... what seems the general frame of mind going into this recording?

SM: I took the title "Throwing out the Baby with the Bathwater" from an article by Jurgen Habermas on Conservatism in politics, which refers to their insistence on seeing change or alternatives as a threat to the existing order and tradition. The title and lyrics take this concept futher with reference to the political situation in the western world, in particular the absence of any serious political alternative to official in any Western Society. The lyrics refer to the seemingly fatalistic acceptance of the way society is run, with no real vision of the future. Social change, and the ability of humanity as a whole to alter their own circumstances for the better and that scociety surrounding them are dismissed as naive. with no alternatives, or competing visions of the future, politics has become a mere technical matter of management and administration. But the lyrics also state that we do not have to accept this nostalgia for the past and the limits and cynicism placed on our future. By constantly questioning and establishing a critique against current arguments a basis and a foundation of alternatives can be made thereby giving us a choice of what kind of society we would like to live in.

AD: Do you typically begin with a concept in mind?

SM: For large scale projects such as albums, live work, etc. we prefer to start with a general theme (or concept if you like). It helps to focus the mind on the songs and give them a direction. This means that rather than just have a collection of sounds and songs from here, there, and everywhere, but not knowing why you use the sounds or what effect you wanted them to have; you have instead sounds and songs working together to create emotion, feeling, and a sense of saying something.

AD: You recently completed a spot for Dutch Radio... which will ultimately become a CD in the Mort Aux Vaches series on Staalplaat. Describe the general set-up for these recordings... are you transmitted live over the radio? Was the material you did all new material?

SM: In October 1995 we recorded a live studio session for VPRO in Holland. This was broadcast along with an interview and some studio material, sometime in December. Staalplaat will release the studio session as part of the Mort Aux Vaches series in early 1996. Since 1993 when we returned to the live scene we do not try to recreate any of the studio material live as it is almost impossible to do exactly what we did in a studio environment. So the material for live performances is all new material. The general set-up is as follows: - All instruments (guitars, flutes, percussion, etc) and vocals go through our own mixing desk. Everythingis played live and treated through various effects. By going through out own mixing desk we have control over our own sound and levels which we change and alter as we perform.

AD: What's the approach to recording new material... who contributes what etc? I'm always amazed at how focused your recordings tend to be, so I assume there's a fair amount of forethought?

JG: As a general rule I write the texts and do most of the vocals. Stephen Meixner often comes up with the original idea and also mixes and produces all the work. Stephen Pomeroy does most of the percussion work as well as providing a lot of the technical ideas for producing the sounds we use. We all contribute to the overall sound picture. In a way telling you that is irrelevant, because we never credit the band members for particular input. The reason for that is our input varies from release to release and we are more concerned with the work we are creating than our own input, for this reason Contrastate can be perceived as an autonomous entity. There is always, as in most music, a certain amount of playing with ideas, collecting and discarding them, as well as a certain amount of forethought concerning the theme of the track and that can be defined by a concept, a text, or a mood or sound that generates associates.

AD: Live shows must be something you enjoy doing as you've appeared at both the Deadly Actions Festival as well as at Festival Karlsruhe... your thoughts on those two shows?

JG: It is enjoyable now though it never used to be. It has taken a good few years to sort our stage set up and a way of communicating what we are saying whilst making it interesting. Playing live is definitely something I enjoy doing. I am a performer anyway and run my performance groep seperate to Contrastate. I am always eager to get on stage, however with Contrastate I think it is important for us that we keep our live appearances to a minimum, this is for various reasons, one is that we write the live music specifically for a show and also work on a performance concept for it. In a recent Londen show we used two dancers that I choreographed into the show. The other reason is that we prefer not toplay a set too often, we played this one three times, which is the most ever. lastly, we are primarily a studio band. The gig in Karlsruhe was important to us because is was our first in four years. I very much felt we had something to prove in the sense of being able to pull it off as a live band, thankfully it worked. Working with Tesco was excellent as they are exceptionally good to work with.

AD: Do you see Contrastate as having built a particular niche?

JG: I think we have built ourselves a small niche wich we would like to expand, and hopefully by playing with bands that do a different kind of music we can reach different audiences.

AD: You've almost exclusively had Ben Hughes do your artwork... who exactly is he and what is it about his work that attracts you?

SM: Ben Hughes is an old friend of mine, We both met at college. I have always admired Ben's artwork and wanted him to do our covers. I like his use of colours and technique. I find his work quite unique. While for some his artwork may seem a little abstract, there is an enormous amount of depth in each painting and drawing, and each usually has something to do with it, either a character, an object, etc. which has an underlying meaning for us. Ben is also a very acomplished musician operating in the alternative rock field in which I usually help by mixing and producing his music. While you correctly point out that Ben almost exclusively does our artwork, another friend of mine Stone, whom I met while living in Germany, also contributes. Again, I really like his artwork and find that it compliments Ben's artwork very well. Both artists work compliment our music, and by using them both exclusively we are seen to have an identifiable product. I am certainly not interested in having so called "shocking" artwork on our products just for the sake of it, a very tired old formula which some groups in the industrial/experimental field still insist on using.

AD: Upcoming projects we can look forward to?

SM: Tere are certainly a few up-and-coming projects yo look forward to. As you have already mentioned our live studio sessions will be released by Staalplaat as part of the Mort Aux Vaches series. In early part of '96 Dirter Promotions will be re-releasing "English Embers", "in Absentia", plus a new track as a CD single. Fourth Dimension will be releasing a new 7" single with an eight page booklet, and sometime in April/May I hope to release on Black Rose Recordings a CD-ep entitled "Goodbye, Great Nation". This release may surprise a few people in that it is a collaboration between Contrastate and another group The Tiger Lillies, who describe themselves as an anarchic castrato blues trio.

AD: What can you tell me about the piece you've submitted for this issue?

SM: Basically in one of your questions you asked if our recordings were for the most part loosely mapped out, and the answer was yes. The track that we submitted for this issue is different in that it is an improvised piece. We do not do too many of them. We wanted to try a different approach to recording and this is the result.

JG: The text is about a dream that I had where I was standing on a beach in the rain and the sensation that as the rain was falling on me my body was beginning to melt and run into the sea. I knew I was still there because I could see everything but I had the impression that I didn't posess a body anymore. Every time I tried to do anything I could only imagine myself doing it, because I repeatedly found that I was in exactly the same place as when I started.



With kind permission by Audio Drudge Magazine, for more information on Audio Drudge contact Jason Mantis at Malignant Records